Best method for removal

[Clark Kenyon]

What methods are professionals using nowadays to remove old wallcovering? For years I have been using a pump sprayer with a removal product called DIF. This gets the job done eventually, but I have been having problems with the water damaging baseboards. The woodwork, being painted on one side only, tends to soak up the water that runs down the wall. This causes the woodwork to swell and curl in the direction of the sealed side. Heavy trim will absorb less, warp less and will generally go back to its original shape when it dries out. But the cheaper, thinner grades of wood tend to stay warped, pulled away from the wall or sometimes they will even split.
One possible solution would be to remove the molding, but that's a lot of work, involving reinstalling the wood, filling new nail holes and repainting it.
One decorator, on discussing this problem with me, suggested that I use too much water in the removal process. But I use no more than is necessary. Is there a product that when mixed with water and sprayed on wallpaper causes the paper to come loose with one pass with the sprayer? Because that's what I would need. As it is, I find that wallpaper has to be fairly well soaked before it can be scraped off. The situations in which I have to remove old wallcovering generally involve vinyl coated paper (which I score first to let the remover through the surface) over drywall.
Clark

[Chris Nelson]

http://www.safeandsimple.com/

[Paul Sullivan]

One decorator, on discussing this problem with me, suggested that I use too much water in the removal process. But I use no more than is necessary. Is there a product that when mixed with water and sprayed on wallpaper causes the paper to come loose with one pass with the sprayer? Because that's what I would need. As it is, I find that wallpaper has to be fairly well soaked before it can be scraped off.
Clark

Though I prefer "the only contractor-grade removal solution" - Safe and Simple, no matter what product you use there will still be removal scenarios that require lots of soaking.

A good part of the battle is the preparation before spraying. For jobs that require heavy soaking - tape cloth drops to the lower part of the baseboard with 2" masking tape. Then tape plastic drops 1 or 2 inches above the top of the baseboard. Score the paper above the masking tape with a razor.

If there's any leakage.... ask Mike Zekich. Better yet (if you haven't already), join the Guild and sign up for one of his classes!

[Jeff Evans]

I still subscribe to the LA Times for one reason only: It makes a great absorbant surface for removals. I use newspaper on every removal job for this purpose, and you can throw them in the recycle bin when you're done. As far as your problem with all the water, I do the following on jobs where you have delicate trim or hardwood floors to protect: First I tape down a layer of plastic sheeting on the floor, then I lay my canvas drop cloths over it, followed by lots of newspapers. What the papers don't pick up, the drops will, and then you have the plastic barrier to protect the floor. As far as the baseboard, I tape newpapers over that too, starting the tape just above the top of the trim like 1/8'". This wont completely eliminate the water hitting the base, but it sure helps, as the water tends to run mostly over it before infiltrating in and loosening the tape. The plastic sheeting almost always lets some water through, so as soon as you finish an area pick up everything and give the base and floor a good wipedown so the water has no time to damage anything.

Yes, removing paper is a messy business, and more water is better. Using Safe And Simple will open your eyes,:eek: because it works faster and thus will cut down on your water useage. It also smells way better, making an unpleasant job a bit less so. Do yourself a favor and get some online. Yes it SEEMS to cost way more than Dif, but it's concentrated and you will use less in your sprayer, thus making it a better deal in the long run.

[Paul Sullivan]

I do the following on jobs where you have delicate trim or hardwood floors to protect: First I tape down a layer of plastic sheeting on the floor, then I lay my canvas drop cloths over it, followed by lots of newspapers. What the papers don't pick up, the drops will, and then you have the plastic barrier to protect the floor... The plastic sheeting almost always lets some water through, so as soon as you finish an area pick up everything and give the base and floor a good wipedown so the water has no time to damage anything.

Interesting system and I definetely need to improve on mine. What I find is though, having the plastic layer on the bottom during heavy soaking completely traps leakage flat on the floor. Plastic sandwich?

The biggest mistake appears to be making seams (joining seperate plastic drops) without huge overlaps (like 3 feet). Better yet, as far as I can tell, one 9 by 12 drop at a time.

[Jeff Evans]

Yeah Paul, maybe plastic on top as well would be a good idea. Don't forget to charge for all this extra time and plastic. They aint givin that stuff away these days. I always try to figure cost for the S&S, a roll or two of tape, and the plastic. Oh, and don't forget depreciation on your pump sprayer:lol:. That's a joke BTW. Then figure in your rate, hourly or whatever you charge. I think a lot of guys sell themselves short on removals. If there's one thing homeowners are afraid of tackling more than hanging, it's removal. Just the mention of it brings up some bad memory they have of TRYING it once. I like it that way, because I can remove paper all day and be a happy camper, so their apprehension is my gain.

[Jeff Evans]

Thinking further about the plastic trapping water on the floor, Maybe the newspapers on the floor, followed by the plastic and then drops. Follow that with more newspapers and it should be as good as a messy, watery job like that can be. I know what you mean by trapping the water on the floor, Paul, that's why I pull away the paper and plastic after I finish each section so that I can wipe any water away that got through. Amazing what damage a bit of water can do to a nice wood floor or baseboard.

[Bob Bachmann]

clark- you may be running into what is called speed board. kind of a compressed wood material that is/was used alot, especially for base. not sure because you said sometimes it will go back to it's original shape. if it's speed board, it must be kept completely dry, as it will split and bulge and will not go back to original shape. replacement is the only option.

alot of guy's have excellent results with safe and simple, i however, am not one of those guys.i find dif works best for me. mike z is a great guy and i'm sure will be glad to send you some samples to try out his product.

[Badams]

I sometimes used duct tape a inch or so above base with plastic wrapped under it. This is when i positively have to keep moisture to a bare minimum. I only score the paper as a last resort. I find that most times I can strip either the facing or the face paper will absorb enough to soften. Scoring, will make some papers more difficult to strip and more damage to wall. Some vinyl will soften enough and become more pliable after wetting, allowing you to strip facing. I have on a couple of cases even painted the front facing with semi-gloss and allow to dry, this helped strip the facing off intact and once you are at the backing ,you got it.

[Bill Archibald]

Clark,

All that my freinds have said is true, especially about Safe and Simple, HOWEVER I know many people who say Dif works very well - - different strokes for different folks.

BUT, I do find that when I tape protection over the trim, excessive water will loosed the tape - even duct tape ... even "WATER PROOF" Duct tape.

Some people will score the tape horizontally about a foot above the base board, and remove almost all of it to the base board, then fold that "flap" down over the baseboard (the last inch or so still adhered to the wall) that creates protection for the base.

BUT, the real solution is to only MIST the paper with each spray application of the removal solution. in other words, do not put so much water that it runs down, only just enough to keep the paper wet/moist.

I think that Bob B. gives the best diagnosis - you probably have crap "wood" and you need to be EXTRA attentive not to get it soaked.

Good luck.

-bill

[Paul Sullivan]

Some people will score the tape horizontally about a foot above the base board, and remove almost all of it to the base board, then fold that "flap" down over the baseboard (the last inch or so still adhered to the wall) that creates protection for the base.

Bill,

Just thought I'd explore some adventures in getting lost. If you meant "score the paper" horizontally, then fold it down for protection, it sounds wonderful. But if it's a paper that needed extra mistings, it's often not going to be stable enough to fold down in one piece.

I guess every little bit helps. Whatta battle.

[Paul Sullivan]

Thinking further about the plastic trapping water on the floor, Maybe the newspapers on the floor, followed by the plastic and then drops. Follow that with more newspapers and it should be as good as a messy, watery job like that can be. I know what you mean by trapping the water on the floor, Paul, that's why I pull away the paper and plastic after I finish each section so that I can wipe any water away that got through. Amazing what damage a bit of water can do to a nice wood floor or baseboard.

Jeff,

What I thought was that since the bonus of having plastic on the top is you get to roll it all up for the garbage newspapers would be great on top of the plastic. Cloth on the very bottom. Of course I wouldn't use newspapers over carpet because of the ink. At least with cloth on the bottom it still takes most of the leakage off the floor.

It can be real easy, and foolproof, when you have a nice long straightaway. Then you get into an 8 roll area with lots of corners. The corners are most prone to leaks. Maybe tape could be run up the corners vertically and down over the plastic as a gutter with the Charlotte Observer waiting to soak such a discomforting lake up. It's mostly ads anyway.

[Jeff Evans]

Yes, you have to be careful with the newsprint bleeding on some floors, but the papers work well for me in most cases. I like the idea of rolling it all up when done. I'll have to try that next time I do a removal.

Wow, I've never delved into the "science" of stripping papers so deeply like this before. This is very helpful to hear all the methods, so better ways can be discovered for doing a tough job.

[Clark Kenyon]

Here's something I tried a few days ago: I stapled old bath towels to the wall right above the baseboard. Worked ok, except a dry towel pulled tight tends to get loose once it's wet, then the water can flow right past it. Fortunately, on this job the baseboard was heavier than the cheap, new stuff I'm having trouble with and there was little no warping (towels also helped).

As for misting (i.e., using a minimal amount of water), that would tend to drag the job out to an intolerable degree. I was lucky on this job, paper was very old, whatever protective coating it had was fairly well deteriorated from exposure to light and air (ever notice how the wc under a picture frame or a mirror can be tougher to get off?).

Clark